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Hello from Chelsfield!

Started by smuudge, Mar 12, 2010, 22:33:05

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smuudge

Hello, i seem to have a growing fascination with the stars, (went out on the closest full moon night earlier in the year, which was pretty impressive) and i am considering taking the plunge and getting myself a telescope.

i have a couple of questions really.

Firstly, light pollution! I live along Worlds End Lane and although street lighting is infrequent we still suffer with the orange glow from street lights and the horrific lighting from London and the valley below. Im curious as to how this will effect my viewing experience and what the limitations will be or that should be expected?

Secondly (and if the above is a favourable answer!) I have set a budget around £250 for a scope. I was hoping to go for a motorised unit as i really want to be able to dive in and let everyone else in the family enjoy it, can anyone recommend a good beginner unit?

Thanks!
Ben


Celeston 130SLT, Nikon D3100

Rick

Hiya, Ben.

Light pollution's most of a problem when you go looking for the faint fuzzies, and much less of a problem when you're looking at planets or the Moon. If you're going to buy a 'scope make sure it's one you can take places and set up easily. Then it'll be something you can take when you go somewhere with a good dark sky too.

A good selection of the foolk who know what's available at present are away at one of our Deep Sky Camps this weekend...

Tony G

Welcome Ben,

As Rick has already said, a few of the people who could answer your questions are camping with their 'scopes this weekend.
If you have transport, and a spare couple of hours, take a drive down this afternoon, and introduce yourself, and ask your questions, and with the equipment on show, you'll see where your budget will take you.
If you stay until evening you may see some of the members in action, so to speak, and if its cloudy you may still see what sort of action they get up to.  :lol: (emptying wine bottles is a common one)
Here is a link to the campsite where they are,
www.blacklands-farm-campsite.co.uk
There is also an observing evening at High Elms on Tuesday, but they meet in the 'Change of Horses' in Farnborough Village at 7/15pm, I think, which is a bit nearer than Henfield, and it does involve a Pub.
(Have you seen the relationship this hobby has with alcohol, which is why, there may be so many members)  :D 
Well welcome again Ben and hopefully we may see you soon.

Tony G
"I'm normally not a praying man, but if you're up there, please save me Superman." - Homer Simpson

doug


Hi Ben. My wife and I don`t live very far from you at Farnborough, and light pollution is always a problem.  As to telescopes, seek advice from those who know, i.e., don`t jump in for the first one you see.  There are some very good beginners telescopes out there; it depends if you want a reflector (one with mirrors) or a refractor (one with lenses).  Talk to some of the members ... why don`t you try to meet us at the Change of Horses in Farnborough village on Tuesday evening around 7.30pm or visit the DSC at Blacklands today, as has been suggested ??

Look forward to meeting up with you soon.

Regards, Rose and Doug.
Always look on the bright side of life ...

Carole

Hi Ben, and welcome to the fascinating world of Astronomy.  We all suffer from light pollution in the Bromley area, although I think where you are situated you are a little better better off than some of us.  This is why we go to Deep Sky Camp so we can have a weekend away together where there are dark skies.  

I agree that a motorised telescope is probably best for you and family especially if you have a GOTO (in case you don't know what that is, most modern motorised Mounts can do just that Go To an object) and provided you have done an accurate alignment (which comes with practice, you might not get it right the first few times), you can easily find the brighter objects quite quickly.

I am not sure what you would be able to get with a budget of £250, but you might be able to get a good second hand scope for that price.  If you're not interested in doing deep sky imaging then a telescope on an ALT-AZ mount such as the ETX.  The reflectors and cassegrain telescopes will give you bigger magnification for your money.  The other members will also make recommendations.  Tony's suggestion of going to Blacklands today is a good one, so if you get these messages in time, hope to see you there.

However, if you think you might want to get into deep sky imaging you will need something completely different.  This hobby has a habit of creeping up on you and over time most of us have upgraded our scopes as we get more and more into it.  

In addition, I recommend getting yourself a planisphere to help find your way around the sky to start with (it should also tell you where the planets are at a given date (on the back).  Make sure you get one for the Northern hemisphere.  

Will you be joining us as a member?  If so please introduce yourself when you come along for a meeting.


Carole

Mac

Greetings from Mac.

Light pollution, hmmmm, dont worry, its the cloudy nights that are more problematic ;)

I'm from deepest London, where the skies are vibrant orange, you just have to live with it. (Not for long, Hampshire's calling :cheesy: :cheesy: :cheesy: :cheesy:)
You can buy filters to remove the sodium (orange glow) from your scope, to that you can see the fainter objects, but you also need a larger scope (catch 22).

But then the councils go and fit those pesky white light street light which are broad spectrum, which you can do nothing about.  :cry:

As said by many, we do have a Deep sky camp, where we like to go and let our hair down, sometimes even do some astronomy. :lol:
i would try and get down as Tony said, so that you can have a look at the different types of scope available.

As carol said get your self a planisplhere make sure its 51.5 degrees north, or the challenges start to get even harder.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Philips-Planisphere-Northern-Degrees-Astronomy/dp/054008817X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1268484898&sr=8-1
Might break the bank @ £7 ;)

You might find that setting yourself a budget is not recommended, because once you get hooked, your always looking at your next purchase.
and the problem is you never stop looking.
Bigger scope
Faster scope
Better mount
bigger camera
and the list goes on on.

As Tony said, most of the people you want to ask are camping this weekend.
So you need to now include, Tent, sleeping bag, camping equipment, ect,ect (See how this hobby just gets better, even more things to purchase now ;) )

A nice sized small second hand scope will probably be ideal, you probably wont get a goto one for the price you are looking at,
I would even consider getting a decent pair of binoculars and using these with the planisphere start looking round the sky, you will be amazed at whats out there, even from light polluted skies.

10 * 50
12 * 50
12 * 70

When you first start out it soon becomes very frustrating, cant find the objects, not in focus, clouds, ect.
One word of advice, DONT GIVE UP. It happens to everyone, especially when you've spent an hour setting up just for the clouds to roll in. :roll:

Above all enjoy, you've taken the first steps.

Mac.

ps. As you will probably be aware, cloudy skies are directly influenced by the purchasing of said optical equipment.
Have a look at this thread to get the idea, :lol:
http://forum.orpington-astronomy.org.uk/index.php?topic=5713.15

Rick

Incidentally, you should now be able to contribute to discussions in other parts of the forum.

Carole

Hi Ben,

If we haven't put you off, just to say, I would consider increasing your budget slightly as you will probably only regret not having done so and end up buying a more expensive one later anyway.

If you're interested in coming to Deep Sky camp, I am pretty sure there are a number of members with tents for sale, so ask before you buy.

I would seriously consider a motorised telescope if you can stretch to it.  I had a manual scope to start with and although I managed to find some of the brighter objects, they drifted out of view very quickly and then you had to find them again, so if you're wanting to show the family, you need to be "tracking" (following the Earth's rotation).  A GOTO will make life a lot easier for you, and most of them have what is called a "Guided Tour", which will take you to all the interesting features in the sky at the time when you are observing. 

Lastly, do come along to our meetings, you can come to a couple as a guest before you decide if you want to join - lots of things going on through the year, lots of friends with the same interest, and lots of members willing to offer advice.

If you are interested in a 2nd hand telescope, there are a couple of sites where Astronomers buy and Sell. 
http://www.astrobuysell.com/uk/
http://www.popastro.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=7

Mike

Welcome Ben.

For £250 you're not going to get a lot, never mind with motors and GoTo. Second hand would be best. For that budget I would forget GoTo and just go for a single motor drive so at least it will track the stars. Also, a Newtonion is your best bet as for such a low budget you can get fairly decent sized Newts second hand.

You're probably better off coming along to a few of our observing sessions first so you can try out different peoples scopes, see what that kit cost and compare them, get an idea of what you can and can't see with them, etc. The most important part of the kit is the mount, not the scope. A good aperture scope on a wibbly wobbly mount is as much use as a chocolate fireguard.
We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. Carl Sagan

Mac

QuoteA good aperture scope on a wibbly wobbly mount is as much use as a chocolate fireguard.
:cheesy:

The Thing

Quote from: Mike on Mar 14, 2010, 10:50:08
a wibbly wobbly mount is as much use as a chocolate fireguard.
But not as tasty  :lol:

MarkS


A chocolate fireguard?  Surely the chocolate would melt, next to a fire?

Rick

Quote from: MarkS on Mar 15, 2010, 15:32:32A chocolate fireguard?  Surely the chocolate would melt, next to a fire?
...which would be a waste of good chocolate. Eat it first. ;)

Mike

Quote from: MarkS on Mar 15, 2010, 15:32:32

A chocolate fireguard?  Surely the chocolate would melt, next to a fire?

And you Mark, are as much use as a candyfloss condom !!
We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. Carl Sagan

Tony G

Sometimes...................just sometimes, I feel Intellectual.  :roll:

Tony G
"I'm normally not a praying man, but if you're up there, please save me Superman." - Homer Simpson

RobertM

Welcome Ben,

Don't let talk of Chocolate Fireguards and Candyfloss Condoms put you off,  there are some normal people in the society ... I think.  No, hang on, that's not right - I was told there were some normal people but I haven't actually come across any yet  :-?  Well, whatever,  a very warm welcome to the society forum and I look forward to seeing you at one of the meetings or events.

It looks like your getting some good advice.  The only thing I would add is whatever you do don't buy a telescope on a whim.

Robert




smuudge

Hello everyone and thanks for the feedback!

I have been doing some more research on scopes over the week and yes i can now see that £250 for a motorized scope is a bit tight.

The scope i keep coming back to is the Celestron 130SLT reflector. Its slightly over my budget (just over 300) but appears to have favourable reviews compared to the other entry level motorised units.

http://www.crazycameras.co.uk/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=16063&aff_code=gg

See the link below, im guessing all of these are possibilities along with the Celestron above (the Skywatcher Explorer 130P SynScan Telescope) appears to be very similar to the Celestron 130 but slightly cheaper?!.

http://www.telescopehouse.com/acatalog/copy_of_Entry_Level_Computerised_Telescopes.html

The main question i have is do go for a refractor, Cassegrain or reflector scope as above, i wonder which i will benefit from most as a beginner!

Thanks all!
Ben

PS: They have just started to install those damned 'white street lights' around Chelsfield. Is this a borough wide installation on every street does any body know?


Celeston 130SLT, Nikon D3100

MarkS

The Celestron 130SLT was my first scope and the optics are very good.  The computerised "Go To" worked flawlessly for me and introduced me to the night sky (I was a complete novice 3 years ago). The mount is not exactly sturdy but any vibrations settle down after a second or two.  The 5 inch aperture is enough to give good excellent planetary and lunar views with a powerful eyepiece. There are certainly better scopes out there, but in terms of overall value for money Newtonians in general, and this one in particular, are difficult to beat.

It even got me hooked on astrophotography - the pictures below were taken with that very scope:  




More at: http://www.markshelley.co.uk/Astronomy/earlierimages.html

Hope that helps.

Mark

Carole

#18
Well that sounds like a good recommendation Mark especially coming from you
QuoteI was a complete novice 3 years ago
I can't believe it, especially with what you are doing now!!!!!

Ben, as a beginner I think a reflector or cassegrain will be best as the magnification is better for the price.  These will give you nice views of the Moon and planets and some brighter deep sky objects.  You can't really see much of the DSOs anyway which is why so many of us got hooked on long exposure imaging which is really the only way to "see" them.  I now have a refractor for DS imaging and the views of the planets are extremely disappointing.  Luckily I did not get rid of my ETX so I have one scope for imaging and one for observing. 

If you're still in doubt, I think the best thing would be to actually go and have a look through a a few telescopes (if we ever get any clear skies)!!!!

Come along to our monthly meeting next week.  Introduce yourself and have a chat with various people about what would be best. 

Carole

smuudge

Hi Mark, WOW, those pictures are fantastic and some of them with a point and click! I think im sold on your pictures (although i appreciate this takes time to finesse)

The Celestron sounds like a great introduction to astronomy so i will aim to line the purchase up within the next few weeks. Mark do you have any recommondations on extras i should purchase when i get the scope (barlow eye piece etc)

Many thanks for everyone's help and i hope to contribute to the forum in the future! Cheers Ben.
Celeston 130SLT, Nikon D3100