Author Topic: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop  (Read 1946 times)

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Carole

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Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« on: Oct 17, 2018, 22:49:24 »
This is really Astrophotography, but it is also chat.

I finally decided that my very old and faithful but clapped out Vista laptop is well past it's sell by date. 
Both right and left clicks have 99% packed up and it will only work with a mouse now.  Which reduces my USB ports to only 2 now. 

Hubs have been unreliable on it, so have never really been able to use EQmod as I didn't have enough USB ports unless I used a 2nd laptop.

2 years ago the power cable packed up and Julian kindly gave me a spare, which has tided me over but it wasn't a good fit and it was always beeping on and off and there was one occasion when I did not notice and the laptop ran out of power and switched itself off mid imaging. 

Finally at last camp I lost 2 hours worth of data, and I am 99.99% sure I ticked the save box as I checked everything 3 times over.  Atik thinks it is a computer problem.

So I ordered myself a new (reconditioned W7) laptop, and have been busy installing the software all day today.  NOTE:  I am avoiding W10 like the plague as I have heard too many horror stories about problems, especially with updates.

Bonus is it has 4 USB ports, so I might even be able to use EQmod and plate solving finally, especially as I "missed" one of my targets at the last camp.  Just need to be weaned off my handset.  But I have used EQmod on odd occasions.

Carole




NoelC

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #1 on: Oct 18, 2018, 16:16:49 »
I find it difficult to believe you are still using it.  Your patience must be nearly infinite! I pensioned off my XP laptop 2 years ago (it's still sitting under my desk if you want it :-?).
I'm still on Win7 desktop, but entirely Win10 in the OBBO, which as you say has the odd update or two.  I upgraded it to Win10-Pro for €10, which gives you more control over updates.  It does something odd with date and time too, but the speed of performance and USB3.0 more than compensate I think.

Noel
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Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #2 on: Oct 18, 2018, 22:52:51 »
I am a bit of a dinosaur Noel when it comes to updating stuff.  I prefer to stay with what I know works and despite its shortcomings the Vista laptop still did most things but it had become my secondary laptop of late (as I work with two laptops when using my dual rig).  With my primary one Lenovo W7 doing the guiding and working the filterwheel. 

When the vista started playing up last camp, I decided to try the hub with my existing  W7 Lenovo laptop,
to see if I could operate both cameras on one laptop as I knew Artemis would allow this, and whilst the hub seemed to work, both Atik cameras got stuck downloading images & flushing, so I guess they don't like downloading through the same hub and to the same laptop.  So was forced to use the Vista laptop one more time. 

I don't update software, for fear of good functions being taken away (which Microsoft frequently do), I still use PHD1, I use photoshop CS3 and am reluctant to upgrade to latest operating systems until all the gremlins have been ironed out.

I recall my frustration at work when Word got updated and there were some very annoying functions, like auto indent, which as a secretary was a real PITA and it took ages to correct the format when it did it without me asking it to. 

So unless there is some real "must have", I don't tend to update.

Carole




Fay

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #3 on: Oct 19, 2018, 07:36:59 »
I cant believe you had that laptop for so long. Vista was the most hated update Windows has done, especially after XP, which was popular.
It is healthier to be mutton dressed as lamb, than mutton dressed as mutton!

Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #4 on: Oct 19, 2018, 11:59:43 »
I agree XP was a really good operating system, and I know Vista was hated by many, but it worked fine for my purposes.

Yes, many people can't believe I had it for so long. 

I am not chucking the Vista  away yet though as it is 32bit and has Gradient Exterminator on it which I need if processing at DSC.  Unfortunately I tried to update my 64bit laptops with GE and bought an upgrade to my licence, but 64bit GE won't install with my version of Photoshop it has to be PS CS4 or higher and I have PS CS3. 
Not prepared to fork out for yet another version of PS in order to install GE just for DSC purposes.  There could come a time when I no longer have any PCs with 32bit, and when that happens I won't have any choice but to update PS as I don't want to be without GE, but will cross that bridge when I come to it.

So I now have 4 imaging laptops.

2 x W7 64bit (used on my dual rig)
1 clapped out Vista which will be used for GE
1 mini laptop which I will use for travel only or when I want to do some additional DSLR imaging say on the Skytracker at the same time as my full rig.

Carole


Apophis

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #5 on: Oct 19, 2018, 13:06:30 »
you have to have the right version 64bit or 32bit for your version of PS which i think yours is 32bit as even though your laptops run at 64bit lots of programs still run in 32bit which is what they were designed for  , you may be able to upgrade to the 64bit version for somethings but the 32bit version of your gradxt licence from your vista laptop should work on the same version of PS on your new laptop as PS is still 32bit thats why the 64 bit licence didn't work.
roger

Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #6 on: Oct 19, 2018, 14:20:32 »
It didn’t work on w7 64bit Roger. I also checked GE website and it says it will only work on 64bit with CS4 or higher. Also l was not getting the 64bit option when trying to plug it into photoshop plugins.

I contacted Russell Croman and he refunded my money.

GE downloads ok but does not install as a plugin to PS.

I can’t remember if l tried i stalling the 32bit GE on it so will give that a try.  I just assumed it would not work on a 64bit laptop.

 Carole

Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #7 on: Oct 19, 2018, 15:16:26 »
Brilliant, GE has installed in Photoshop on my new W7 64bit laptop using the old 32bit GE licence, must try it on the Lenovo too.

Thanks for that Roger.

So now I don't have to hang on to the old Vista laptop.

Carole

 

Apophis

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #8 on: Oct 19, 2018, 16:33:08 »
i have lost my GE since moving from PS CC 64bit (payable monthly) to my own copy of PS CS2 32bit , i have emailed russell crowman twice but looks like its a no go to swap the licence back to 32bit.
Roger

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #9 on: Oct 19, 2018, 17:06:42 »
Quote
I am not chucking the Vista  away yet though as it is 32bit and has Gradient Exterminator on it which I need if processing at DSC.  Unfortunately I tried to update my 64bit laptops with GE and bought an upgrade to my licence, but 64bit GE won't install with my version of Photoshop it has to be PS CS4 or higher and I have PS CS3.

Why dont you run a virtual machine on your laptop.

Download Virtual box, set up a windows machine, either 32 or 64 bit or even both, install whichever version of windows you want to it and then install your photoshop ect....
Thats all I do, Im  running a few Virtual PC's on a Mac. 
XP, 2000, W7 plus a couple of unix systems.

There is no limit to what you can do.

You can even install W10 to try it all out if you wanted.

Mac
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Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #10 on: Oct 19, 2018, 20:45:12 »
Not sure what a virtual machine is or what I would use it for.  But I have everything up and running on the two laptops I will be using now.  So sounds a bit surplus to requirements.

Carole
« Last Edit: Oct 19, 2018, 21:08:39 by Carole »

Mac

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #11 on: Oct 20, 2018, 15:21:44 »
Quote
But I have everything up and running on the two laptops I will be using now.  So sounds a bit surplus to requirements.

It saves running two laptops....

Just one computer running another computer on itself.

I have ALL my PC software running on my Mac.

Apple Mac running windows XP running Photoshop.



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Mac.
Never, ever, argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #12 on: Oct 20, 2018, 17:33:45 »
Do you need internet connection to make it work?

It would be useful to be able to view the second laptop on the same screen, but using a single laptop for two cameras downloading doesn't work as I already tried it and both cameras got stuck on download and flushing.

They were fine as soon as I put them back on separate laptops.

Carole

Apophis

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #13 on: Oct 20, 2018, 17:43:27 »
With APT you can run 2 cameras and imaging sessions at the same time, without all that virtual machine setup Mac ,
Roger

Mike

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #14 on: Oct 21, 2018, 11:52:17 »
There are no problems with Windows 10. I have it on all of my devices and have to say it is the most reliable software MS has ever made.
We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. Carl Sagan

Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #15 on: Oct 21, 2018, 12:48:56 »
Quote
With APT you can run 2 cameras and imaging sessions at the same time, without all that virtual machine setup Mac ,
In theory you can do this with Artemis too, but needing more USB ports than I actually had I tried to do it through a hub, and both cameras got stuck on download and flushing.  As soon as I put them back onto two laptops they were fine.

Quote
There are no problems with Windows 10. I have it on all of my devices and have to say it is the most reliable software MS has ever made.
Read many horrors stories Mike, including Mark getting an update in the middle of an imaging session.  People getting updates which messed up their installed software.  Updates can't be turned off, though apparently you can choose the time. 

I don't need all these problems.

Carole

Apophis

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #16 on: Oct 21, 2018, 12:54:45 »
Totally agree with that Mike,i have setup up manual updates on mine.
Roger

Mac

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #17 on: Oct 21, 2018, 14:23:04 »
Quote
With APT you can run 2 cameras and imaging sessions at the same time, without all that virtual machine setup Mac ,

APT is PC only. I went to Mac about 3 years ago.

I still run XP on my laptop, all my processing is on the Mac, some through the virtual machine.
Far faster than my laptop, even in a virtual machine......

i do have windows 10 as a Boot camp. which annoyed me as the IOS wouldn't allow windows 7, which I adore.

Still........
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Apophis

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #18 on: Oct 21, 2018, 14:34:05 »
Didn't realise it was pc only, i know they stopped updating xp a while ago ie security loopholes? Yea i liked W7 when it first came out as it never crashed or allowed all my software to run, however old!
Roger

Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #19 on: Oct 21, 2018, 15:52:28 »
I like W7 too which is why I prefer to stick to it for the time being.

Carole

MarkS

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #20 on: Oct 21, 2018, 21:18:39 »
Quote from: Mike
There are no problems with Windows 10. I have it on all of my devices and have to say it is the most reliable software MS has ever made.

Sure it is very reliable but yes there are big problems if you are using it to run unattended applications as is typical for astro-imaging.  Twice it has happened that the laptop has been in the observatory running applications (i.e. actually controlling imaging) and "Windows" has unilaterally decided to close those applications that I need to be running and install updates, which by the way took an hour or more.

Sure you can argue that I should have known in advance to set some schedule to preform those updates (I've done that now) but why should I have to second guess all the weird things that Windows might try to do in advance?

W7 is a known beast that I have control over it (I think).  W10 is an unknown monster that who knows what it's going to do - like overwriting my EQDIR Mount drivers every time it updates (I've now put them in a separate folder where I can re-install them each time).

Mark
« Last Edit: Oct 21, 2018, 21:29:01 by MarkS »

Apophis

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #21 on: Oct 21, 2018, 21:45:59 »
Not sure why it would do that as never happened to me , changing edmod drivers on update i mean,
Roger

RobertM

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #22 on: Oct 21, 2018, 22:07:09 »

W7 is a known beast that I have control over it (I think).  W10 is an unknown monster that who knows what it's going to do - like overwriting my EQDIR Mount drivers every time it updates (I've now put them in a separate folder where I can re-install them each time).

Mark

True but you are relying on backwards compatibility to keep your programs running and that will eventually run out, the same for old drivers such as the Prolific.  For mount drivers I use FTDI serial to USB chipsets and never have any issues, the com ports always keep the same number and the driver never disappears.  I only use Windows 10 now and wouldn't go back (but yes I have been bitten a couple of times).

Robert


MarkS

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #23 on: Oct 21, 2018, 22:58:01 »
Quote from: RobertM
Quote from: MarkS

W7 is a known beast that I have control over it (I think).  W10 is an unknown monster that who knows what it's going to do - like overwriting my EQDIR Mount drivers every time it updates (I've now put them in a separate folder where I can re-install them each time).

Mark

True but you are relying on backwards compatibility to keep your programs running and that will eventually run out, the same for old drivers such as the Prolific.  For mount drivers I use FTDI serial to USB chipsets and never have any issues, the com ports always keep the same number and the driver never disappears.  I only use Windows 10 now and wouldn't go back (but yes I have been bitten a couple of times).


I'm not knowingly relying on backwards compatibility.  Maybe the Prolific driver I'm using is old but when W10 updates it to the latest Prolific driver, that's when it all stops working!  I guess there's some kind of bug in the new driver.  I end up uninstalling the updated driver and putting the old one back.  That doesn't make any kind of sense to me.

It's really lucky I methodically keep a separate copy of all my drivers otherwise I don't know what I would have done.

By the way - it is USB and not the old serial port thingy.  It's the HiTec Astro EQDir USB adapter for the EQ6.

Mark
« Last Edit: Oct 21, 2018, 23:12:45 by MarkS »

Carole

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #24 on: Oct 21, 2018, 23:09:41 »
This is precisely the sort of problems I am talking about with W10 that I have heard about.  I do not want to have these sort of problems and would rather run with a system that FOR ME works.

Carole

MarkS

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #25 on: Oct 21, 2018, 23:22:31 »
Quote from: Carole
This is precisely the sort of problems I am talking about with W10 that I have heard about.  I do not want to have these sort of problems and would rather run with a system that FOR ME works.

Carole

Yes, I'm seriously thinking about reverting back to W7 for the observatory.  I can't be doing with this hassle.

Mark

MarkS

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #26 on: Oct 21, 2018, 23:41:55 »
Quote from: Mac
Quote
With APT you can run 2 cameras and imaging sessions at the same time, without all that virtual machine setup Mac ,

APT is PC only. I went to Mac about 3 years ago.


But you run all your PC stuff on the Mac don't you?  So just run APT on your Windows virtual machine on your Mac.

Mark

RobertM

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #27 on: Oct 22, 2018, 09:15:04 »
I also had this problem with the EQDirect cable (RS232 Serial to USB) Hitec Version.

I found this thread which 'might' help with the Prolific driver: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-hardware/prolific-usb-to-serial-comm-port-windows-10/0a4f8e48-7135-4434-9d10-349c9ce87fcf?auth=1 .  There is another issue in that a lot of Prolific chip sets out there are fake - later versions of the driver software only work on the genuine chip set; I remember posting something about this a few years ago (I had masses of issues with the Hitec version and com ports).  I made some FTDI Chipset versions a while back and and have had no issues since.

I also have one device with a Prolific chip set that must be either a newer chipset or genuine as I've also not had any issues with Win10.

Apart from the updates issue which can be worked around I have had no other problems, blue screens also seem to be a thing of the past.

Robert

« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2018, 10:02:25 by RobertM »

Mac

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #28 on: Oct 22, 2018, 17:09:34 »
Quote
But you run all your PC stuff on the Mac don't you?  So just run APT on your Windows virtual machine on your Mac.

I could but the macs not in the observatory. Plus all the software that i use does everything i need it to do at the moment.

I could probably do with looking at whats new out there, but as and when i get time i'll probably start up again..

As for windows updates, As soon as all of my software was running on the laptop without any issues, i just disabled everything including updates, plus all of the services that were never needed.

I did try getting windows embedded to install on the laptop but gave up as that was a nightmare.

Mac.
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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #29 on: Oct 22, 2018, 19:55:36 »
That makes complete sense!

As far as I know my cable is genuine Hitec so maybe that particular Hitec cable is not using the genuine Prolific.

Mark

Mike

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Re: Finally I am replacing my Vista laptop
« Reply #30 on: Oct 23, 2018, 09:42:59 »
Automatic updates on Windows 10 can be turned off and set to manual only.

https://www.drivereasy.com/knowledge/how-to-stop-windows-10-update/
We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology. Carl Sagan