SX problem.............give me strength!!!!!!

[Fay]

After sorting the SX battery cable connection. Not getting a lot from the camera.

Have reinstalled disc & gone online for downloads.

Testing with PHD.

It is taking images, as screen is flickering, but bit striped, when holding had over end, it is still light. Have tried with Astroart & scope, striped again. Not reacting when end being covered.

Hope someone has an idea, it is driving me nuts

Thanks

[mickw]

Is it ACTUALLY taking (stripy) images or is it just the program going through the motions ?

Sort of sounds like the the computer is not receiving a signal from the camera

[Fay]

Yes stripely images in PHD & Astroart. I can see it flickering on PHD as it is taking the short exposures.

I have tried camera on desktop as well & is same. Just hope camera is not broken.

Yes, seems like a signal is there but not quite 

[mickw]

You didn't pop in for a cup of cocoa and let the foxes play with it did you 

[Fay]

not aware of it

[RobertM]

Check with Terry at SX - there always seems to be yet another firmware or driver version that works !!!

[Mike]

Fay. Using Starlight Xpress capture software I get perfect images.

Using MaximDL or Astroart I get interlaced images.

Reading the forums this seems to be an issue with these old SXV cameras unless you Bin 2x2.

But using the SX capture it works fine, no issues at all, taking perfect pictures of leaves at the end of my garden.

[Fay]

Thanks for your help, Mike. Glad there is nothing wrong with the camera.


I have always used 1x1, with Astroart & High Res  Progressive, Odd Even. It has always been ok & I have never used the SX capture program.
The problem I encountered was also there when using PHD, which had always been ok.

Anyway, again, glad camera is ok, thanks. Can I pick it up early, late afternoon today, is that ok?

[Fay]

SX now works via mains, in AA & PHD. Mike gave me a new USB 2 cable.
Must have been a kink in the old one

I have made a new battery cable/connector & the camera does not work via battery. Any ideas would be good. Thanks

[mickw]

Blown fuse in power supply or battery lead ?

Low power in the battery - not enough for the camera ?

Try using mains again to make sure you haven't pulled something out.

[Fay]

The light is on on the brick using battery but camera is producing  stripey lines.

[Fay]

I have sent a mail to Terry Platt, if he doesn't know, then no one will. I have already paid £40 for a new board in the power brick.

Have put it on UKAI as well.

[mickw]

Going back to Mikes post

Fay. Using Starlight Xpress capture software I get perfect images.

Using MaximDL or Astroart I get interlaced images.

Reading the forums this seems to be an issue with these old SXV cameras unless you Bin 2x2.

But using the SX capture it works fine, no issues at all, taking perfect pictures of leaves at the end of my garden.

What capture software are you using ?

[Fay]

Mick, God is looking out for me today.....about time!

Sussed it.................The SX needs it's own 75ah car battery!!

It will not run off the 17ah yellow battery, or on a car battery with the laptop as well. The Atik runs happily with the laptop, The mount has to have it's own car battery. 

The SX, if taking short subs, has to be on interlace setting, if on long subs, High resolution progressive. Also there is a venetian blind effect setting, that you can use. Also when taking flats, you have to remember to change  SX from high progress to interlacing. Not that I have to think about that any more as use the Atik for imaging. I want to use the SX as guide camera.

[mickw]

Have you always needed 2 batteries or is this something new you're trying ?

If you're getting this much grief, I would be inclined to stick the batteries on charge after every session 

Glad it's sorted

[Fay]

I do charge them after every session.

I am thinking, that last time I used the SX, i ran mains power up the garden, I cannot really remember, but this is possibly so.

I will be able to light up Bromley the amount of batteries I will have!!

[RobertM]

I will be able to light up Bromley the amount of batteries I will have!!

Well at least we'll know where all the light pollution is coming from 

[Fay]

This is what Terry Platt said:



It's the different ground connections that cause the problems. You are forcing the computer ground to be the same as the camera ground when you run them from the same battery. This is not recommended and is probably causing problems with the signalling from the computer.

[mickw]

You just need a link between both batteries, probably just the negative.
Doesn't have to be a thick cable either

[Fay]

Oh, so two batteries would then serve, mount, laptop, SX?

[mickw]

I would think so - Just re-read terry platts message, it looks like he's suggesting camera on it's own battery and run the mount and laptop off a seperate one. 

Anybody else having to use 2 batteries ?

[Fay]

Yes but mount will not run off battery with anything else

[Mac]

My paper work with the HX9 say DONT run the laptop and camera off of the same battery, use two different ones.

I just use the inverter for one of them, that way the voltages are not referenced to each other,
eliminating the grounding problems.

I know an inverter is inefficient, but it will solve the problem.

If you use two batterys, dont connect them together, leave them separate.

~Mac.

[RobertM]

I remember having big problems with the SXV-H9 when I used a 12v PSU to power the laptop from the same battery for just that reason.  Mac's solution of an inverter will isolate the laptop and solve that problem.  In the field I always power the laptop that way with a seperate battery and have never had a problem.

Robert

[Fay]

That was going to be my next question, how do Mac & Robert power their Sx camera's. I thought you plugged everything into a multi cig connector.

Also, I do have an inverter, but they take a lot of power themselves, don't they?

[Fay]

Last night, this reply was put om UKAI in answer to my question:

From the Winchester Electronics SX website, http://www.starlightccd.com/ under the questions and answers, it states the following:

5. How do I run my camera off 12VDC? Go To TopQ&A Go To TopTop
    There is an orange 2-pin DC power connector on the side of the power block. It is polarity protected by an internal diode and the lower pin is the positive terminal.

        NOTE:To be absolutely safe, do not run your camera and computer from the same battery, or serious damage could result! All the cameras should be safe when running from the battery used for the telescope drive. You should also be able to connect the laptop to the same supply, if it is via an inverter. The only reason for the caution about common battery supplies is because you may damage the laptop parallel port if the camera tries to take its cooling current via the computer ground. This is unlikely to happen, but not impossible.

            The main reason for this is to avoid the possibility of a 'ground loop' through the computer printer port. For example, if the camera and computer are running off the same DC supply, the negative of the camera supply will also be applied to the computer parallel port, via our cable. If the camera or computer negative lead becomes disconnected from your battery, the camera or computer will continue to run via the parallel port ground connection and it can be subjected to several amps DC.

            Another possibility is that the computer 0V supply is not directly connected to the chassis of the machine, and this can also set up currents between the camera and computer.

            If you are sure that neither ground lead will become disconnected and that the grounds are 'common', there should not be any problem, but be cautious! Otherwise, using the AC input via an inverter is quite safe.

When I think my fuse kept blowing!!!!!

[mickw]

So mount and camera is OK on one battery, but have laptop on a different one 

I think all your power leads could do with checking as well - something started all this off 

[Fay]

Well Mick, my mount will not operate with anything else.


I used to use an inverter, until Ian told me it was taking a lot of the battery power for itself. That may be when I last used the SX in the field. Which would explain why it was working ok then.

Bit scary I  could have done damage to the laptop. Hope it has not got anything to do with all this DMK malarky!!!!!!!!
 Do you think, Mac?

Also, is the 17 ah yellow jumpstart not powerful enough for the SX? It would not work with that on it's own.

It is getting like an Agatha Christie mystery!

[mickw]

According to the SX M7 overview, the camera uses less than 1 Amp, so your yellow battery (17AH) should keep it ticking over for 17 hours 

Probably a dumb question, but is the yellow battery Fully charged ?

[Fay]

Yes, I only use it for dew heaters. All my batteries are charged after every session. I should think about a leisure battery, but they are too heavy for me.

[mickw]

too heavy for me.

You could always beat up an old lady and nick her shopping trolley 

Or..............

http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?moduleno=97489

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=9676677&fh_view_size=10&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=trolley&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&ts=1257416652993&isSearch=true

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/76279/Access-Storage/Manual-Handling/Wolfcraft-TS600-Folding-Platform-Truck

[Carole]

So mount and camera is OK on one battery, but have laptop on a different one

Hmmm, better check my stuff before DSC then. 
I'm running DSLR own battery,but software for this on the laptop. 
Laptop, Mount and SC3 (as a guide cam) off leisure battery.

I have an invertor,and was going to run all 3 off of that.
Does this mean I will have problems/need to get a 2nd Leisure battery!!!

Carole

[mickw]

No, the problem Fay is having is with the SX needing it's own power.

Although depending on the size of your battery, you may have trouble - or not.

If you haven't already, try all your stuff set up how you intend using it during the day and see how long the battery lasts.
Image the wall again 

Or better still a clock - won't have to time anything then 

[Mike]

Yep. Set it up and try it out.

It's normally not a good idea to run a laptop or other devices on the same power line as the camera as electronic noise can be introduced into the circuit degrading your image. Although depending on your set-up and quality of equipment it may be negligible.

[Mac]

Yes, I only use it for dew heaters. All my batteries are charged after every session. I should think about a leisure battery, but they are too heavy for me.

Those dew heaters draw quite a large current normally, 2-3 amps, so your 17AH battery will last somewhere in the region of 3-8 hours normally,

As for the laptop, hmmm difficult question to answer,
It says in their post parallel port? i thought they were usb ports! anway.

Just plug something you know to be working into each of your ports, USB, Serial & Parallel, if they all work, then they are fine,
That's probably the easiest way for you to test them.

As for the inverter being inefficient,
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=48723 90% Efficient.

so in a word no, you lose only 10%

Laptop power assuming 150W = 12.5A off of 12V
17AH battery would last. 1.3 hours powering the laptop
with the invertor powering the laptop you loose 10%
so it would be rougly 1.2 hours
roughly 6mins. different due to inefficiency.

As Darth Vader once said, "use the invertor". or was that "Use the Force"
might sole those niggling problems,

Anyway, I though you might have used the mains down there this time.

Mac.

[Fay]

Mac, the webcam is serial, don't have a parallel, that is ok.
  It was just a thought, i will bring invertor with me to DSC. So do you connect inverter to battery & then still plug two items into inverter?

[Mac]

It was just a thought, i will bring invertor with me to DSC. So do you connect inverter to battery & then still plug two items into inverter?

you can, or you can use their mains.
I've got a spare lead, you can borrow

[Fay]

Thanks Mac

[mickw]

You should at least try the battery/inverter thing to find out what your limit is should we end up somewhere without power.
At least give it a shot indoors.

[Fay]

well Mick, I want to use SX for guiding, I usually use webcam, so can always use that. I seem to remember my batteries were always running down too early

[Carole]

It's normally not a good idea to run a laptop or other devices on the same power line as the camera as electronic noise can be introduced into the circuit degrading your image

Well I might get away with it then because I'm only planning to use the SC3 for guiding, and the camera has it's own battery.

I'll give it a try before DSC.  I have a car size 12V battery btw.

Carole